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Offline Georgeski  
#26 Posted : 20 February 2019 07:26:05(UTC)
Georgeski


Posts: 4,559

It's apparently faster to 60 than the Type R
Offline Penn  
#27 Posted : 20 February 2019 09:28:10(UTC)
Penn


Posts: 3,090

Love the look of this, I think they’ve nailed the genuine Hot Hatch recipe.

Will be amazing every day, comfortable and not cost a fortune to run and will be lots of fun - it looks superb too.

Offline Georgeski  
#28 Posted : 20 February 2019 09:37:58(UTC)
Georgeski


Posts: 4,559

Couldn't agree more Penn. First time I've wanted an ST. Great finance deals will be the icing in the cake.
Offline Colm_ire  
#29 Posted : 20 February 2019 11:04:16(UTC)
Colm_ire


Posts: 20

Originally Posted by: Penn Go to Quoted Post
Love the look of this, I think they’ve nailed the genuine Hot Hatch recipe.

Will be amazing every day, comfortable and not cost a fortune to run and will be lots of fun - it looks superb too.



This sums a hot hatch up. Can't wait to hear the test drive reviews, has Ford managed to achieve what they claim, i.e. Jekyll and Hyde at the touch of a button.

If they have actually achieved it, and only time will tell, then it will be the class leader by a mile. Comfort when you want it, and racey when you want it, configurable to suit the journey at the touch of a button just like a hot hatch should be in 2019.... lets see if they've nailed it
Offline Colm_ire  
#30 Posted : 20 February 2019 11:26:02(UTC)
Colm_ire


Posts: 20

Originally Posted by: Kirsty172 Go to Quoted Post


i'd suggest if those things are important to you, and you want a proper hot hatch, buy an FK8 civic type r. it is much, much, much better than a focus ST will ever be. and not much more to pay for it too.


"proper hot hatch" !!!! The new ST is a sub six second 0-100kph car with LSD and adaptive dampers for everyday comfort or stiffer ride when required. That is what a proper hot hatch is if the drive backs up the spec, no one knows that yet.

As for Civic. Technically brilliant, I've driven one, astonishing engine and gearbox. Only 4 seats, no good to me, and, those chavtastic boy racer looks, no thanks, looks like a teenager with bad taste went to Halfords shopping for stick on bits. Megane, ST, Golf, Cupra etc... all look purposeful and fast without looking OTT like the Civic

Edited by user 20 February 2019 11:27:17(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Offline Georgeski  
#31 Posted : 20 February 2019 11:46:36(UTC)
Georgeski


Posts: 4,559

Originally Posted by: Colm_ire Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Kirsty172 Go to Quoted Post


i'd suggest if those things are important to you, and you want a proper hot hatch, buy an FK8 civic type r. it is much, much, much better than a focus ST will ever be. and not much more to pay for it too.


"proper hot hatch" !!!! The new ST is a sub six second 0-100kph car with LSD and adaptive dampers for everyday comfort or stiffer ride when required. That is what a proper hot hatch is if the drive backs up the spec, no one knows that yet.

As for Civic. Technically brilliant, I've driven one, astonishing engine and gearbox. Only 4 seats, no good to me, and, those chavtastic boy racer looks, no thanks, looks like a teenager with bad taste went to Halfords shopping for stick on bits. Megane, ST, Golf, Cupra etc... all look purposeful and fast without looking OTT like the Civic


Couldn't agree more!
Offline MrRS  
#32 Posted : 20 February 2019 13:50:37(UTC)
MrRS


Posts: 68

Ford also has the advantage of the warranty friendly Mountune tuning route. Over 300 bhp should be easy with that engine.
Offline Kirsty172  
#33 Posted : 20 February 2019 15:10:37(UTC)
Kirsty172


Posts: 4,950

Originally Posted by: MrRS Go to Quoted Post
Ford also has the advantage of the warranty friendly Mountune tuning route. Over 300 bhp should be easy with that engine.


good luck with that. i had a warranty claim denied by ford after they'd already replaced the failed item already under warranty for exactly the same reason. they then tried to deny that the first warranty claim was legitimate and that the dealer had proceeded without authorisation. first warranty claim at less than 1000 miles, second at 3500 miles. car sold in less than 13 months from new with less than 5000 miles on it.

and that was a 30k+ focus rs...so you'd be reasonable to expect the best service possible amongst their range.

i'd also be very interested to see the real world fuel economy of that oversized engine, and i anticipate heavy car.

as i say, i think the megane will better then st for a focused car, but as you say you really need a warm hatch by the sounds of things. in that case, the st will definitely be a better compromise for you i'm sure, providing it doesn't break. it is true that the civic will be too demanding and focused for you, although it will last for 20 years. as i say, it's your money so buy what ticks the most boxes for you.
Offline sunnylunn  
#34 Posted : 20 February 2019 15:26:13(UTC)
sunnylunn


Posts: 897
Location: Renault owner &#128512;

is 280bhp now classed as warm? its a bit more than a Megane, which is hot, I'm getting confused
Offline Kirsty172  
#35 Posted : 20 February 2019 15:58:57(UTC)
Kirsty172


Posts: 4,950

Good question. Perhaps it depends where it sits in the range. The RS will go above the ST. Maybe that one is a mega hatch then?
Offline Colm_ire  
#36 Posted : 20 February 2019 17:18:18(UTC)
Colm_ire


Posts: 20

Originally Posted by: Kirsty172 Go to Quoted Post


.....

as i say, i think the megane will better then st for a focused car, but as you say you really need a warm hatch by the sounds of things. in that case, the st will definitely be a better compromise for you i'm sure, providing it doesn't break. it is true that the civic will be too demanding and focused for you, although it will last for 20 years. as i say, it's your money so buy what ticks the most boxes for you.


Who said anything about a warm hatch. Nothing warm about sub six second 0-100km.
'focused' is a code word for compromised to live with everyday, and 'warm' is a code word for 'capable of being a comfortable every day and fast and stiff when required'.

Don't forget the new ST has not only 276bhp, but also a whopping 420NM, and is said to be lighter than the outgoing model (await official figures)

The days of being stuck being bounced around in 'focused' suspension everyday are gone, it's old hat to have only one mode, and even older hat to not allow customers but an LSD into one of the two fixed choices!!!

As for the civic, again, who said anything about it being too demanding and focused!!! it has only 4 seats and looks ridiculous, so it's out.

Renault will sell you a 280bhp FWD car with no LSD, (fancy abit of one wheel drive wheel spin anyone) ridiculous.... oh wait, they'll let you pick a diff, but then they make you pick a track biased suspension setup, aka Cup, with no way to alter it according to your journey, road surface, passengers, mood etc.....

Hence why i give credit to Ford for not putting such ridiculous customisation barriers in place like Renault did. Time will tell if they got it right... and such a shame that Renault are stuck in the past, as in my opinion, it's one of the best looking hot hatches on market
Offline Penn  
#37 Posted : 20 February 2019 18:31:50(UTC)
Penn


Posts: 3,090

Originally Posted by: Georgeski Go to Quoted Post
Couldn't agree more Penn. First time I've wanted an ST. Great finance deals will be the icing in the cake.


If I wasn’t in my 330e for another 2 and a bit years, I’d be test driving this and seriously be considering ordering.
Offline Georgeski  
#38 Posted : 20 February 2019 18:50:45(UTC)
Georgeski


Posts: 4,559

Originally Posted by: Penn Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Georgeski Go to Quoted Post
Couldn't agree more Penn. First time I've wanted an ST. Great finance deals will be the icing in the cake.


If I wasn’t in my 330e for another 2 and a bit years, I’d be test driving this and seriously be considering ordering.


I'm tied into my fleet of cars at the moment, but when there are decent deals in a year or two then I'm going to seriously consider one. There should be a lot of Mountune stuff for it by then as well.
Offline Penn  
#39 Posted : 20 February 2019 19:14:52(UTC)
Penn


Posts: 3,090

We’ll be spoilt for choice in 2 years from all the returned lease cars!
Offline Kirsty172  
#40 Posted : 20 February 2019 23:44:25(UTC)
Kirsty172


Posts: 4,950

Originally Posted by: Colm_ire Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Kirsty172 Go to Quoted Post


.....

as i say, i think the megane will better then st for a focused car, but as you say you really need a warm hatch by the sounds of things. in that case, the st will definitely be a better compromise for you i'm sure, providing it doesn't break. it is true that the civic will be too demanding and focused for you, although it will last for 20 years. as i say, it's your money so buy what ticks the most boxes for you.


Who said anything about a warm hatch. Nothing warm about sub six second 0-100km.
'focused' is a code word for compromised to live with everyday, and 'warm' is a code word for 'capable of being a comfortable every day and fast and stiff when required'.

Don't forget the new ST has not only 276bhp, but also a whopping 420NM, and is said to be lighter than the outgoing model (await official figures)

The days of being stuck being bounced around in 'focused' suspension everyday are gone, it's old hat to have only one mode, and even older hat to not allow customers but an LSD into one of the two fixed choices!!!

As for the civic, again, who said anything about it being too demanding and focused!!! it has only 4 seats and looks ridiculous, so it's out.

Renault will sell you a 280bhp FWD car with no LSD, (fancy abit of one wheel drive wheel spin anyone) ridiculous.... oh wait, they'll let you pick a diff, but then they make you pick a track biased suspension setup, aka Cup, with no way to alter it according to your journey, road surface, passengers, mood etc.....

Hence why i give credit to Ford for not putting such ridiculous customisation barriers in place like Renault did. Time will tell if they got it right... and such a shame that Renault are stuck in the past, as in my opinion, it's one of the best looking hot hatches on market


well like i said, sounds like you've made your mind up for a compromised warm hatch. 0-60 doesn't really indicate a car's capability as a hot hatch, although if that is your measure then there's also a good number of fast diesel estates that might also be of interest to you.

it will be good if it is lighter than the last focus. for sure, the focus RS i had was heavier than my house, and it felt it unfortunately whilst driving. the motoring reviews strangely didn't make as big an issue of that as it really was...

i see no conflict actually with renault's offering. the person who 'needs' an lsd equipped car will typically also want a more deliberate chassis set-up. the 2 are not in conflict. check out the reviews of the fiesta st with and without it's diff. you might want to think if you really need one.

so like i say, i don't actually see renault being 'in the past' with their selection of chassis selections. i don't see a conflict in their set-ups. i think you'll probably find that when an fk8 CTR driver is using their car in 'comfort' mode, they'll not be testing the front axle traction that much to warrant the lsd...so if that comfort is important to you, the softer ford sounds perfect for you. you've done an excellent job of selling it to the target audience.
Offline CraigI  
#41 Posted : 21 February 2019 06:15:38(UTC)
CraigI


Posts: 988

I’m surprised people like the look of this.
Like the previous incarnation of the Focus, I think this looks terrible.
It bulges in all the wrong areas (the crease along the bottom of the door looks like the car has been damaged), has a fairly terrible stance and how long are Ford going to churn out those dated looking Recaro’s.

Ford do make good looking cars still - I think the Edge looks great - but this isn’t one of those.

Edited by user 21 February 2019 06:16:20(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Offline sunnylunn  
#42 Posted : 21 February 2019 08:44:12(UTC)
sunnylunn


Posts: 897
Location: Renault owner &#128512;

how do people know how the Focus ST drives? not sure there's been any write ups yet, or have I missed them? Looks are personal, one mans meat is another mans mutton and all that. The Ford Edge looks gash for me.
Offline Black225  
#43 Posted : 21 February 2019 09:33:18(UTC)
Black225


Posts: 1,125
Location: On The Edge

Strange that Ford have 2 different engine strategies, down sizing the Fiesta and up sizing the Focus.
Looks wise the photos I've seen so far aren't doing it any favours.
Offline MrRS  
#44 Posted : 21 February 2019 17:31:38(UTC)
MrRS


Posts: 68

The press seem to be liking it big time so far. Bring on the group tests with the other big players.
Offline Kirsty172  
#45 Posted : 21 February 2019 18:25:44(UTC)
Kirsty172


Posts: 4,950

Originally Posted by: Black225 Go to Quoted Post
Strange that Ford have 2 different engine strategies, down sizing the Fiesta and up sizing the Focus.
Looks wise the photos I've seen so far aren't doing it any favours.


that's a very good point and observation. they had the ability to upsize the 1 litre i guess to upgrade in the fiesta st. in the focus, i guess downgrading the 2.3 wasn't cost effective, even though it is environmentally friendly. they also made a big advertising thing about that too.

it'll interesting how they pitch it therefore in this case with an engine upsize (and, a very lazily tuned one it would appear also).

fuel economy will be interesting, my focus rs drank like a fish, must worse than the m135i before even with an engine 30% smaller.
Offline Marc_250  
#46 Posted : 21 February 2019 18:59:47(UTC)
Marc_250


Posts: 5,118

Originally Posted by: Kirsty172 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Black225 Go to Quoted Post
Strange that Ford have 2 different engine strategies, down sizing the Fiesta and up sizing the Focus.
Looks wise the photos I've seen so far aren't doing it any favours.


that's a very good point and observation. they had the ability to upsize the 1 litre i guess to upgrade in the fiesta st. in the focus, i guess downgrading the 2.3 wasn't cost effective, even though it is environmentally friendly. they also made a big advertising thing about that too.

it'll interesting how they pitch it therefore in this case with an engine upsize (and, a very lazily tuned one it would appear also).

fuel economy will be interesting, my focus rs drank like a fish, must worse than the m135i before even with an engine 30% smaller.


I guess it comes down to what engines/manufacturing processes were easiest and cheapest to deliver what targets they had set for this car. I did read they had the option of going for a small capacity engine (I think the 1.5L from the Fiesta ST) but it was a bit marginal to deliver 275hp from a reliability pov.

Fuel economy comes down to drag, weight and the drivetrain as much as the engine so I'd guess it'll be okay.

Wouldn't be surprised to see Ford release a 'performance' version of the ST at some point later in its life (prior to RS) given the engine used.


Not seen pricing/reviews etc yet but whilst I can understand the appeal of this ST (the regular Focus looks pretty decent to me) I do like the bespoke looks of the RS Megane and CTR more. That said CTR is a mid 30k car now? Discounted M2 Comp within reach etc? Swings and roundabouts...A good condition mapped used Mk3 Megane RS gets my vote over the lot!

Edited by user 21 February 2019 19:00:34(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Offline Georgeski  
#47 Posted : 21 February 2019 20:20:36(UTC)
Georgeski


Posts: 4,559

Originally Posted by: Kirsty172 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Black225 Go to Quoted Post
Strange that Ford have 2 different engine strategies, down sizing the Fiesta and up sizing the Focus.
Looks wise the photos I've seen so far aren't doing it any favours.


that's a very good point and observation. they had the ability to upsize the 1 litre i guess to upgrade in the fiesta st. in the focus, i guess downgrading the 2.3 wasn't cost effective, even though it is environmentally friendly. they also made a big advertising thing about that too.

it'll interesting how they pitch it therefore in this case with an engine upsize (and, a very lazily tuned one it would appear also).

fuel economy will be interesting, my focus rs drank like a fish, must worse than the m135i before even with an engine 30% smaller.


That’s because BMW make some of the best engines - they’ve International Engine of the Year award more than any other manufacture (double the second highest in fact). The engine in the M135i is an absolute peach.
Offline Kirsty172  
#48 Posted : 21 February 2019 21:58:42(UTC)
Kirsty172


Posts: 4,950

Originally Posted by: Marc_250 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Kirsty172 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Black225 Go to Quoted Post
Strange that Ford have 2 different engine strategies, down sizing the Fiesta and up sizing the Focus.
Looks wise the photos I've seen so far aren't doing it any favours.


that's a very good point and observation. they had the ability to upsize the 1 litre i guess to upgrade in the fiesta st. in the focus, i guess downgrading the 2.3 wasn't cost effective, even though it is environmentally friendly. they also made a big advertising thing about that too.

it'll interesting how they pitch it therefore in this case with an engine upsize (and, a very lazily tuned one it would appear also).

fuel economy will be interesting, my focus rs drank like a fish, must worse than the m135i before even with an engine 30% smaller.


I guess it comes down to what engines/manufacturing processes were easiest and cheapest to deliver what targets they had set for this car. I did read they had the option of going for a small capacity engine (I think the 1.5L from the Fiesta ST) but it was a bit marginal to deliver 275hp from a reliability pov.

Fuel economy comes down to drag, weight and the drivetrain as much as the engine so I'd guess it'll be okay.

Wouldn't be surprised to see Ford release a 'performance' version of the ST at some point later in its life (prior to RS) given the engine used.


Not seen pricing/reviews etc yet but whilst I can understand the appeal of this ST (the regular Focus looks pretty decent to me) I do like the bespoke looks of the RS Megane and CTR more. That said CTR is a mid 30k car now? Discounted M2 Comp within reach etc? Swings and roundabouts...A good condition mapped used Mk3 Megane RS gets my vote over the lot!


very very wise words. that's why i ended up with a honda uk pre-reg fk2 ctr with 2000 miles on it. remapped of course with a small selection of other upgrades...(i would like an fk8 ctr, and actually the meg trophy makes quite a strong case for itself, but unfortunately they ain't worth the 8k cost to change to get into one of those)
Offline sunnylunn  
#49 Posted : 22 February 2019 08:19:30(UTC)
sunnylunn


Posts: 897
Location: Renault owner &#128512;

what bhp did your Type R manage after the remap and what other upgrades have you got on it Kirsty? The Honda is thee benchmark in this sector, but I wish they would tone down the looks a bit with a facelift.
Offline Georgeski  
#50 Posted : 22 February 2019 09:26:33(UTC)
Georgeski


Posts: 4,559

Originally Posted by: sunnylunn Go to Quoted Post
what bhp did your Type R manage after the remap and what other upgrades have you got on it Kirsty? The Honda is thee benchmark in this sector, but I wish they would tone down the looks a bit with a facelift.


I know of someone who had the new CTR and it (surprisingly for a Honda) wasn't very reliable on track - kept on overheating. Got rid of it after only a few months.
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